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UBC Reports Mar 29, 1972

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MARCH    29,   1972,   VANCOUVER   8,   B.C.
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A  Special Report
See  Pages  One  and Two
An interesting facet of contemporary lifestyles is the growing interest on the part of
people, young and old, in communal living.
Communes are seen, on the one-hand, as a
liberating life-style and, on the other, as a threat
to the nuclear family, the life-style which
characterizes modern, industrialized society. In
the essay which follows and the interviews on
this and the following pages, Mr. Eric Green, a
graduate student in UBC's English department,
explores the commune phenomenon with a UBC
faculty member and two students.
There seem to be two deep-seated motives behind
different convictions about social order and about the
family unit, which is probably the most important
agency for determining character and personality in any
society. These motives are for variety and for unity.
The commune, whether it involves people disaffected
socially and politically, or people who have arrived by
hard thought at the belief that the nuclear family
life-style is absurd, is simply one way of experiencing
what we call family life.
The intellectual backgrounds of modern life include
our long-standing love affair with the idea of brotherhood. Brotherhood suggests the ultimate "extended"
family, the world human community. And that old idea,
humanism, remains one of the most potent counters in
our intellectual life.
It is to these ideas, or ideas similar to them, that
proponents of family life-style experiments point for
support in their arguments in favor of the communal
movement. That is, man must share. Therefore, they say,
let's find better ways to do it.
To explain the rapidly-growing interest in communal
life in North America they also point to important
changes in economic and social realities in our time.
The kinds of ideals they seem to value suggest that
the communal experience awakens them from a crushing
sense of isolation and loneliness. They identify the roots
pf this malaise, this ugly set of feejings, with the nuclear
family and with the kinds of narrowed experiences that
this family life-style seems often to impose on the child.
Dr. Rhett Hagerty, assistant professor in UBC's
School of Home Economics, has a balanced view of the
critique of the nuclear family. {See interview below.) He
states that it seems to have endured past the time of its
true usefulness, but acknowledges that it did serve a
useful function over a period of history. He sees the
motive for change as evidence of a cultural time lag, and
the rise of interest in the communal movement as a
reaffirmation of older, more valuable patterns for family
The nuclear family, a family unit comprised of father,
mother and their children, is an experiment if we take a
long view of history. The communal movement represents a return to a kind of freedom: to affirm the value
of a deliberately socially-involved life.
This contrasts sharply with a freedom to deliberately
avoid human contacts, to be alone or isolated in society.
Both of these remind us of a familiar present reality,
that people do feel they are isolated, even in crowds. Or,
in privacy, they find they cannot distance themselves
from social dictates and taboos and take pleasure in
being alive.
The critics of the nuclear family life-style share J
universal dislike for what they call the "piggy-piggy,
oink-oink" vision of social life. They see the mass media
as mindless tools of a consumption-crazed society.
This rising tide of criticism can be seen throughout
North America and Europe. It is, to some extent, a
signal that the cult of progress that came along witlv
mass production technology and the emergence of mass
culture built around isolated families is on the wane. The
more sensitive, intellectual and articulate people who
have tried communal living experiments agree that they
learned a great deal from and were enriched by their
People who argue against social experiments say we"
shouldn't tamper with human lives. They forget that the
physical sciences, economics, and politics are constantly
transforming society, and they do so often in a blind
fashion, without consulting their guinea pigs before or
after the fact.
Having experienced the narrowness and isolation of
the nuclear family living arrangement, many yourif
people and some older people are actively trying to find
new ways to relate. They take a chance and live through
a kind of social experiment — the commune. It combines
living and learning in a unique way.
Young people are taught in our school system that we
are a society that believes in variety, change and
individuality, and yet we harrass people who try to
express it. We believe that we are all part of a world
human community, and yet relate to each other in
suspicion and distrust as individuals and as nations^^
The people who involve themselves in com^^al
UBC's expert on communes and family life is
Dr. Everett L. "Rhett" Hagerty, assistant*
professor in the School of Home Economics. A
graduate of Brigham Young University and
Columbia University, where he specialized in
marriage counselling and family life education,
Dr. Hagerty is the author of a forthcoming book
The Elephant that Never Came: The Hippie
Search for Meaning, which includes a studjtmf
communal living. In the following conversaAmm,
he talks with UBC graduate student Eric Green.
ERIC GREEN: Have you been able to define clearly
the idea of a commu ne?
RHETT HAGERTY: I've been trying for some tirse*
to define what a commune is. There are various kinds of
things that get called a commune. For my own purposes,
I tend to stick with an extended family kind of
definition. And I tend to favor the rural commune as
more representative of what I would call a commune. I
won't accept as a commune a group of males living
together, although some people would.
GREEN: There must be both male and female
HAGERTY: With either the presence of children or
openness to the presence of children, should someone
have them. They should be living somewhat cooperatively. It doesn't mean that they necessarily hav£
to pool all of their financial resources.
In order to be strictly defined as a commune they
have to be communally involved in their own economic
support. This may mean that they pool money they have
from other sources or it may mean, and this is a
definition or concept I would prefer, that the communal .
group itself functions as an entity supporting itself.
Otherwise, it would be a co-op.
A  basic  working  definition   of  a commune would
involve just about everything there is to say about a
commune.   It   would   involve   an  examination   of  the
economics, the social relationships, the politics, and trte-.
psychological situation involved.
The Israeli kibbutz and the Chinese communal
system, which are massive things involving from ten to
20,000 people, are a different kind of communal
organization. They farm and manufacture everything
collectively. *^
I'm more interested personally in the kind of thing
that   is  happening  to  the  so-called hippies. They are
2/UBC Reports/March 29, 1972 RING AND CARING
living arrangements are aware of these contradictions.
They were not happy in the experiences they had in the
nuclear family situation, so they are trying something
different. They feel they have nothing to lose, and,
perhaps, a great deal to gain.
Those who study the family in history and in its
present form say: "The family, more than any other
human institution, shapes the personality and character
of every individual. The ultimate survival of our society
depends on the quality of families."
Oo we patch up the nuclear family, or do we mature
to the point where we acknowledge the obvious value of
having a number of alternatives for people to select
from? 1
Do we shore-up the nuclear family experiment by
developing endless recreational, cultural, educational and
social programs in the community for people who have
lost all interest in participation? Or do we declare toldly
that true family life is vital to us, and that experiments
„ wilt not only be tolerated but welcomed generously?
Much is at stake in the answers to these quesrtions.
Some people claim it is our ultimate survival. Since there
is nothing more than that, we must acknowledge that
the issue is very serious.
The more articulate people involved in communal
- living situations say they want more "intensity" in their
lives. They want life to be more, not merely In and
through socially-approved art, but in the fact o1 their
own human relationships. That is why the idea of a
search for new meaning is important. And why, given
real historical circumstances shaping young lives in
our time, the communal movement must be seen in
different ways and appreciated with an intellectual
honesty that can appraise where we are now in terms of
the quality of family life.
The communal movement seems to be based on a
need for pairing, sharing and caring. The hidden, but
often unfulfilled assumption behind all family life is that
ail these needs will be answered. Critics of the*movement
label it "utopian." Many of these critics are, or identify
themselves as. Christians. They must be insensitive to
their own religion, since it was founded on a sociological
vision more akin to the enriched possibilities-of an
extended family than the exploitive, isolated and protective nuclear family. And what religion is more "utopian"
than Christianity?
Social and economic realities have psychological
effects. Family sociologists point to the distress that
unemployment, poor housing, bad recreational facilities
or absence of them, and the intellectual dishonesty,
incoherence in values and the ethical bankruptcy that so
much modern life forces on families. The fact that we do
not do very much sophisticated thinking about the
quality of family life suggests we see the forest but not
the blight that threatens it.
There is no question that inflation, rising unemployment, and changing mores in our society are
resulting in a drastic re-think of the nuclear family
Set against the backdrop of post-World War II
history, we get the sense that the upheavals in society
are the product of a sensibility shift whose significance
we can only begin to appreciate. The communal movement is only one facet of the new sensibility, but it
could well be the forerunner of more extensive reforms.
rial Life Isn't New'
setting up an alternative to the nuclear family. The idea
is to develop alternative family living systems. A family
system as opposed to a large collective.
GREEN:    The   two   basic   kinds   of   families  you
recognize are the commune and the nuclear family. In
what ways generally  does this new alternative differ
from the traditional family?
|| HAGERTY: That's an interesting comment . . .   you
"said  "the traditional family." We tend to look at the
isolated, nuclear family — the mother, father and their
q^Bdren — as the traditional family.
The nuclear family is actually the new experiment in
history. It emerged with the Industrial Revolution, when
we moved from an agrarian society into the larger,
-> c,ity-oriented society. I 'm sure there were nuclear
families in the city 200 years ago, but they were the
exception. The extended family — the mother, father,
grandfather, aunt and uncle, and children, or some
variant of this — all living together, is much more
common in history. The tribal system is much more
• historically prevalent as a system.
The nuclear family model is not meeting the needs of
many people. My field of interest is the family, and that
is why I am interested in the communal system. It is
seen by many people as offering an alternative to this
isolated style of living where you tend to relate in depth
to only one other adult, who is responsible for satisfying
■t all your needs.
GREEN: Returning to the point about the emergence
of the nuclear family as the dominant family life-style —
was it because of the pressure of external, economic,
historical circumstances? Did the new methods of
production, the new ways of relating and organizing for
production, force changes on people?
HAGERTY: The new mobility of people especially
had something to do with forcing changes on people.
There were new transportation systems, and people left
the country they were in or moved around more inside
it. People moved to the city, or from one city to
This nuclear family style was a very practical system
for the family. You could just move the father, mother
and children without having to move aunts, uncles and
'"t"","'~ grand parents.
It served the emerging, practical needs of the time.
which historians have seen fit to describe comprehensively as "capitalist." But, in changing, we lost some
important things. We see people in the communal
movement trying to recover them.
GREEN: You see the communal movement as an
attempt to re-establish a real, traditional value, a value
which is deeper than the nuclear family? Is this value
primarily the element of "extensions?"
GREEN: So, in fact, this movement is a truly
conservative movement, not a radical one?
HAGERTY: There is nothing new about the
communal system. I think that is quite right. It is a
conservative movement.
Anything that someone does "right now" seems
radical. But there were, in both the United States and
Canada in the mid-1800's to the early I900's, many
communal living systems in practice. They disappeared
or failed for a variety of reasons. They struggled against
the nuclear family model even then. They were, for the
most part, much larger than the kind of thing we see
happening now.
The current system varies in size from five or six
people to the largest group I've visited, which had just
under 100. Some groups have numbered up to 200
GREEN: Then there are a wide variety of different
ways to relate communally?
HAGERTY: That is why you have trouble defining
the word commune, at least right now. I visited this
summer, in one location, a number of communes in the
Interior. I could visit one and go across the Valley and
visit another one. Then I went further up the valley and
visited several more. They were all apparently very
different in structure, yet there is some sort of
commonalty that ties them together. They identify with
each other as part of the same kind of movement.
But the structure from group to group is quite a bit
different in terms of size, the way they support
themselves, and the way they conduct their interpersonal relations.
GREEN: What common element do they share? A
"spirit?" A psychological reality created, an ambiance?
That kind of thing?
HAGERTY: Yes. Much more that kind of thing than
any structural thing I could identify. I have talked to
many groups of young people who live communally to
try to identify what a commune is, and what makes it
different from other forms of group living currently
being experimented with. The only thing we could get
down to is a psychological value.
I keep coming back to the idea of a family — a feeling
of family as opposed to just a repetition of a static living
GREEN: Does this feeling have something to do with
a need for security, support, for having a broad range of
emotional needs satisfied, including some that in some
or most nuclear families are considered to be negative?
In other words, does a commune accept a broader range
of needs where the nuclear family narrows them down
and says a certain range of them are good while others
are bad?
HAGERTY: I think that is definitely true.
GREEN: You make a distinction between communal
living and other family arrangements in terms of
consensus, replacing the concept of blood ties?
HAGERTY: I tend to use various terms: for instance,
"consensual extended family." If you talk of the
extended family you are talking about blood ties. When
you try to apply the term to a commune you do have to
qualify it further, as a consensual extended family.
Other than the offspring of the people involved, although there might be brothers and sisters involved,
there are rarely blood ties in a commune. Remember
also that our ordinary marriages are consensual, and they
are the basis of the nuclear family.
GREEN: Isn't it true that in our society, in terms of
the law and juridical processes, we tend to identify
family life with simple blood ties?
HAGERTY: Currently none of these communes
would be legally identified as families. There are some
strange laws about family life, especially in B.C.
Communes have some of the legal responsibilities but
none of the privileges of the typical nuclear family.
There are presently some people working to change the
laws related to families.
There were some laws set up around 1945, mostly in
reaction to the Hutterites and Doukhobors. The
commune, for instance, can't go out and buy property as
a family, but if they are living as a group and establish a
debt and one moves the group has a responsibility to pay
off the debt. They have most of the negative responsibilities and none of the privileges.
There are people and organizations in B.C., and
especially here on campus, that are trying to get laws
modified in order to get the communal groups recognized legally as families, to get some of the benefits a
family might have.
GREEN: Why would a society militate against a new
alternative in the way a family might be set up?
HAGERTY: Why does a society militate against
anything that seems new? Or anything that appears to
them to be radical? They're afraid of it. It's not new in
fact, as we said.
A number of things have happened. The communal
movement has grown out of the so-called hippie culture.
So along with that we associate it with drugs and sex, all
sorts of evil things. Of course, here in B.C. we're
associating it with the evil draft dodgers and people from
the States who are coming up here and corrupting you
Communes are really in trouble wherever they are in
North America. Only in certain small local situations do
they find they are welcomed. People say, "It's those
strange people who are doing something new," not
realizing it isn't new. When I lecture on family life,
communes, on culture and counter-culture, people
always say: "What if everyone did it?"
Well, what if everyone did? I've never seen anything
yet that everyone does. I've never seen anything so
popular that everyone does it. I can't think of a thing
that everyone universally does, except certain obvious
biological things. In cultural reality there is a constant
motive for diversity. People actively seek new alternatives. People reveal a fundamental fear when they say,
"I'm going to have to .. . ." "They're forcing me to . . . ."
There are fears that these strange people with their
long hair and funny dress are going to corrupt me or my
GREEN: Do you think this fits with the traditional
Christian ethos, or what we have made of it? What we
take to be a Christian life-style is middle-class, the
nuclear-family style,  living in a single-family dwelling.
Please turn to Page Four
UBC Reports/March 29, 1972/3 COMMUNES
Continued from Page Three
Don't we tend to represent as the ideal all these things?
Wasn't the original Christian vision of family, of the
human family in extension, closer to the commune than
the nuclear family?
HAGERTY: We tend to view everything as if it has
always been the way it is now. Our present way is the
right way, the way it has always been, the given thing.
This is the way it should be, we think.
From one point of view, everything is a temporary
fad. There is really nothing sacred about anything we're
doing at this moment. The character of the family
doesn't remain static. If the family hadn't changed, if
the nuclear family style hadn't emerged when it did,
we'd still all be living in extended family situations. We'd
probably be less advanced industrially, but maybe that
wouldn't be a negative thing. We seem to be able to see
only this narrow span of about ten years. Beyond that
we are blind.
GREEN: Who tends to get involved in a commune?
Who tends to go out and actively seek some alternative
way? What kinds of backgounds do they come from?
HAGERTY: There are a lot of misconceptions about
this. It is not, as is believed by many people, entirely a
young people's movement, although they tend to be
keenly interested and actually represent the largest
number of people involved in communal living arrangements.
I lived with a group about eight years ago. I was one
of the younger people in the group. There were 88 of us.
We had a baby about nine months old and a man who
was about 65. We had a lot of people in the group in
"their mid-thirties, forties, and fifties. If you get out,
away from the university areas and away from the urban
communal groups in Vancouver, you find groups involving older people. Around the universities and
colleges many students get involved. It has a little to do
with disaffection and a lot to do with plain economics.
GREEN: You think there is an important distinction
between an urban commune and a commune in a rural
HAGERTY: There are a number of differences
between them. You find on examination that there are
some older people in communal groups in the urban
environment; these people may be in their late twenties
and early thirties and are often professional people. For
example, I know a group of lawyers and their wives who
have decided to live communally. Generally the urban
communes represent a younger group than that.
People involved in communal groups come from the
upper and middle classes. Not so much from the working
class. At least not yet. There are not many from
ethnically isolated groups. There aren't many blacks, and
you don't find (in the New York area) many Puerto
Ricans. There aren't many people from the minorities.
People in communes have usually experienced
affluence. They are often highly educated. The one
communal group I spent a long time with was in New
York. There was a small college in the town. There were
more people with degrees, more advanced degrees, in the
communal group than there were in the college.
GREEN: What that seems to suggest is that lower
classes and oppressed ethnic groups tend not to be
attracted to communes because they are still aspiring to
HAGERTY: That's right. They're still striving for
what this group's trying to get away from.
GREEN: The groups that are trying to find an
alternative are from the upper and middle classes, they
have tasted the "best" society has to offer, and they
want to get away from it?
HAGERTY: This is the big difference between the
hippies and the blacks. They have a lot of sympathy for
each other but the black is striving to get to where the
hippie's trying to get out of. To get away from the two
color television sets. You've seen the ads on TV for a
little gadget that you put under your kitchen cabinet
and it unrolls your aluminum foil for you. The kids are
saying, "Hell, this is asinine." They're reacting against
this developing, enforced uselessness.
If you visit these communes, you see they're not only
doing this, they are also baking their own bread. They're
grinding their own flour and growing their own wheat.
They make their own candles, soap, even their owrr
butter. They make their own clothes, build their own
Partially what they are saying is, "For so long you've
told me I can't do anything, or I should get a machine to
do it." And they say, "I'm finally rediscovering that I
can do something. I can do all these things." Our society
4/UBC Reports/March 29. 1972
has gotten so packaged, so pre-packaged, that really they
don't know they can do anything, and it's a great
The average person goes to work and he turns six
little nuts, day in and day out. He may not even know
what these six nuts are attached to. He may never, and
probably never, sees a finished product. His whole life is
plastic and meaningless. His children ask why he does it.
It doesn't make any sense to them.
So these kids say, "I can't live this robot, plastic
existence. I've got to get back in touch with my hands
and with something."
GREEN: Do you think the nuclear family, with its
problems, suggests, since it is the characteristic arrangement, that our culture is in crisis? Does the degree of
energy behind the movement to experimental family
groups, with all their variety, suggest that our culture is
in trouble?
HAGERTY: I think I would agree. But it depends on
how you view things. The isolated nuclear family was a
means of adapting to real changes. It was an effective
means for a while. I think the fact is that it is now
getting into trouble, and not meeting real needs. You
can read it in several ways. You can make a good
argument that the society's not in trouble, but is simply
evolving. I tend to think it's in pretty serious trouble,
but it must be seen in part as an evolutionary kind of
GREEN: The fact that alternative family arrangements are being tried is a sign that the culture is healthy,
it's dynamic, and is capable of altering?
HAGERTY: Yes. Family style is not static. It is
changing, it is trying to adapt to fit the changes that are
taking place in the culture.
I would like to be able to believe that in ten or 20
years, a person getting out of school, who decides to get
married and have a family will have some alternatives to
choose from. He or she can choose a nuclear family or
something else. The communal system allows for more
relationships. More intense relationships. You don't have
to demand from one person that they meet all your
needs. It may be that we'll have various alternatives. You
could live in a polygamous group, you could have a
group marriage, a communal group or the nuclear family
I don't tend to see the group marriage as fundamentally a communal group. In a communal group you
may be married but not necessarily inter-married.
Surprising as many people seem to find it, there are not
really many inter-sexual relations in the communal
GREEN: The sexual element in communes is not as
important as people imagine?
HAGERTY: No. I have studied about 140 communal
groups. Only three of all those involved a formal,
agreed-upon arrangement to have inter-marital sex.
GREEN: Many people wonder why communal
group-living experiments tend to break down. Are they
more prone to breakdown than the nuclear family
HAGERTY: Communal systems break down for the
same kinds of basic psychological reasons that nuclear
families fall apart. People get out of sorts with each
other and find they cannot relate meaningfully.
People marry very blindly, thinking that love
conquers all. They think it's just going to work
miraculously. It's called "doing what comes naturally."
When they get married, they find out it's not all that
beautiful and romantic all the time. So they get
discouraged and they fall apart, rather than adjust the
marital and family ideal.
Communal groups are falling apart in the same way.
They imagine, "We're going to go and conquer the land,
we're going to just all groove together, we're going to get
a thing together. We're just going to put it all together
spontaneously." They find out that they have to work at
it, and they don't want to. So they break up.
But communal groups run into other kinds of
problems. They've all, as individuals, been raised in the
isolated nuclear family, and they find it hard to cope
with this larger number of relationships. It's not as easy
as they thought. They have to learn new skills in relating
and some of them are finding it hard to adapt. Some of
the people in the rural communes, who go out thinking
they're going to go back to raw nature, to the land,
think that they will be self-sufficient. They go out all
bright-eyed and bushy-tailed and find that crops just
don't spring up miraculously.
GREEN: The special problems that communes run
into would include antagonism from other people in the
society surrounding them?
HAGERTY: That's another area where communal
systems have run into trouble. There is pressure to get
rid of them. A group will move in. They rent a farm,,
start living in it and the next thing you know they're
evicted. They buy a place and the next thing they know
there'll be health departments coming out to inspect
them. People form vigilante groups to harrassthem. I've
seen them go that far.
GREEN: Would you say that there is harrassment in
British Columbia tike this?
HAGERTY: It's not that bad. There is harrassment of
the whole counter culture, but not that bad. I should
add that any amount of harrassment is too much.
GREEN: Are there places in B.C. where the local
people would welcome this kind of family living
experiment in their midst?
HAGERTY: There is an area that I studied this
summer. I toured around B.C. this summer with another
fellow studying the communal movement. We found one
area in the Kootenays to  be doing very well.  It was
because of the Doukhobors.
GREEN: The Doukhobor background, because it is
fundamentally communal, tends to make them more
HAGERTY:   They're  not so interested  in material1
possessions,  so  there   is an  immediate community of
values. These people will take sections of their land ^LM
say, "We're not using it. You use it." They say, "I'm not
using this building. Move in. Just help yourself. Don't
pay rent. Just live here."
Then they come and  help them  learn skills. Thev_<.
teach   them   to   make   bread.  And  to   make  borscht.
They've been accepted by the group and work under the
barter system often. And the people in the communes
seem to be doing well.
GREEN:   The   Doukhobor   family   arrangement   is,
then, an extended family? It tends to welcome people •
with similar values?
HAGERTY: Yes. Besides that, there is a unique thing
happening there. The Doukhobor system is breaking
down. The way they describe that breakdown is very
interesting. There used to be one borscht bowl. It was in
the middle of the table. There was one ladle.
Everyone would ladle out the borscht and pass the t-
ladle around. Then they went to separate ladles. Finally
they went to separate bowls. They figure that's the end
of the system. That's a sign that it's all over.
They have a prophecy that their system will be
replaced by another group. They see the communal
movement, coming out of the cities, as fulfilling this
prophecy of the replacement of their communal system.
They have the additional force of their religious belief to
support them.
GREEN: How many times have you personally been
involved in communal living experiments or arrangements?
HAGERTY: I've lived communally three times. Once,
a long time ago, just for a summer. A friend of mine and
I were studying the family. We became interested
through studying the kibbutz system. We decided our
families would live together one summer. There were
just two families and the children.
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jldlbtl irju-i ma©-]: obcoj'V'3nnol 'iraantaotl *3( \zm o^DbbUlbstl. Jldrts According to films and TV series, medical
students work their wonder and awe in hospitals
like the Vancouver General Hospital or St.
Paul's. Yet the only medical school in the
province is the Faculty of Medicine at the
University of B.C.
Medical schools are the most balkanized part
of any university and UBC is no exception.
UBC's dean of medicine has an office on campus
and another at VGH and splits his time between
the two.
n.   fnc.Liii.ui j.uucru mwai itztir ri iv trcui ijuiitzriis
and not diseases in the abstract, so part of his
JT.afning .must. be., in_.hospit.gls... Since.hospitals
don't have the concentrated basic science power
a university has, don't have the teachers,
libraries or laboratories, part of a medical
student's education must be at a university.
Medical schools in North America were once
independent of universities. The results were
disastrous. The schools were forced to link up
with universities so that the schools' standards
had less chance of slipping.
What's taught at UBC's Faculty of Medicine,
like everything else taught at the University, is
exq mined .^ scrutinized^ criticized^ probed.,
prodded and pinched by professors from all over
the University and not just from the Faculty of
This doesn 't mean standards can't slip. It
means if they do, everybody knows about it.
Since the university-plus-hospital medical
school system was introduced in North America
about 100 years ago, one pattern of medical
training has dominated.
In their first one or two years of medicine,
students committed to memory vast amounts of
facts and formulas in an incredible feat of
patience and endurance.
This was their trial by fire in university
classrooms and laboratories in the basic medical
sciences: anatomy; biochemistry, the chemistry
of life; physiology, the function of the body in
health; pathology, the function of the body in
disease; and pharmacology, the effect of drugs
on the body.
Students had to take on trust that a lot of this
theoretical work was important. Sometimes it
was important. Sometimes a lot of it was
unimportant and the students knew it. Their
teachers were scientists and rarely doctors.
If they survived the ordeal the students were
allowed to enter the hospital portion of their
training and study surgery, psychiatry, pediatrics
and other clinical medical subjects, taught by
doctors who were members of the medical
Throughout their training, their schedule was
tough and highly organized by the medical
Today, this system is eroding. Like many
other aspects of medicine, medical education is
undergoing rapid evolution and is on the
threshold of profound change.
the next dean of UBC's Faculty of Medicine, brings an
untypical advantage with him for dealing with the
transition ahead. Dr. Bates is entering UBC's medical
school on a double passport. A chest physician and
respiratory physiologist, he enjoys dual nationality in the
two sovereignties of medicine, the basic medical sciences
and clinical medicine.
He holds medical and specialist degrees and certification from universities and hospitals in the U.K. and
Canada, including Cambridge University, St.
Bartholomew's Hospital in London, and the Royal
Colleges of Physicians and Surgeons of London and
Dr. Bates, 50, came to Canada in 1956 to take a
■position as associate physician at Royal Victoria
Hospital in Montreal and associate professor in the
Department of Medicine at McGill. He was appointed
head of the physiology department at McGill in 1967
and is senior physician at the Royal Victoria Hospital.
He was director of the respiratory division in the joint
cardio-respiratory service of the Royal Victoria Hospital
and the Montreal Children's Hospital.
He welcomes some of the changes prognosticated in
medical education but qualifies others. At the moment,
he says, medical education is undergoing uncertainty
"It used to be thought that an M.D., once he got his
oegree, couio uo anytHing in perpetuity; ur7"Datea~5cnu:""
"He could give anesthetics, deliver babies, vaccinate
people, do minor surgery. For a long time medical
schools continued to train people as if they were going
to a one-man operation in Labrador."
This approach may seem crazy today when the
totality of knowledge is doubling every 15 years. But at
least the approach was easy to understand. The moment
the approach is abandoned. Dr. Bates said, "you push
the boat of medical education out onto the seas, you
really leave shore. You get into a tangle of questions.
How much of what should be taught? And when should
different subjects be taught in the medical program?
Should students have contact with patients in their first
trend in spreading the basic medical sciences throughout
a medical student's training, exposing him to patients
early in his training, and allowing him greater freedom in
his selection of courses"
"We're moving away from a didactic situation with
uniform examinations at the end. We're going to require
certain "minimal standards in everything, a defensive
knowledge in most subjects in medicine, and we're not
going to insist that all students do precisely the same
"You can absolutely throttle a medical student by
jamming so much material and responsibility onto him
that he never reads a non-medical book, never goes to
listen to a symphony, is so over-educated in medicine
that he has no time to grow on his own. A student has to
be protected from that."
Dr. Bates considers himself fortunate to have studied
medicine at Cambridge University where students were
expected to do things other than study medicine. Most
Thursday afternoons he skipped his medical lectures and
did archeological research in the university library. He
said  in the long run  it didn't matter a damn that he
ctinnoH    hie   f-l accoc    artH    hts    hac   r-nntim 10H   hie   haKit   r*f
f".p*f..U       '.P.,      VI UthS*..,      Ul  IU        Ilk.       I  I UO     W I llll IUt.U      ■ I I J      I1MUIL     \J I
pursuing non-medical interests ever since.
He reads about 60 non-medical books a year. Mostly
sociology, history, biographies and modern fiction. He
has a passion for modern poetry, and writes some
hirnself. Post-T.S. Eliot poetry interests him the most.
TTPaf >g HTPflF
>;; is t)r. David V. (Bates, pictured below, who will join the U#C)
Faulty On Ju'y '-Pr^^^.- vtfto enjoys a reputation as a top-ftight
chest surgeon and respiratory physteipgist, bel ieves one of the highest
duties of a medical school is to instil self^ritJcisrn in its students.
Medical students, he says/ have to be trained to handle the most
difficult tasks in medicine and research must remain ai major activity
ot faculty members. t>r. Bates is alio an avid reader—- 60 non-medical
books a year -anda p^
author of a book on air pollution, v.;-.';::
■: :■ ■; Assistant I rtf^rriraifetf Officer, U6C: .■.,.
especially Denise Levertov of the U.S., Philip Larkin of
Britain, Yevgeny Yevtushenko of the U.S.S.R., The San
Francisco group, translated French-Canadian poetry and
the poems of Earle Birney. He usually travels with two
or three books of poems to read.
While head of the Department of Physiology at
McGill University in Montreal, Dr. Bates helped organize
the Montreal Junior Symphony Orchestra and sits on its
board of directors.
-kkJI uunilll^ll lib,
wrote a book on air pollution just published by McGill
Press. He said he wrote it because there were two kinds
of books on air pollution. One type is the $90 textbook
with good technical information in it. The other type are
paperbacks which are polemics, political statements with
no information about air pollution.
He discovered the need for the book after setting up a
course on air pollution for engineers and high school and
college teachers in Montreal. He toyed with the idea of
calling it An Intelligent Women's Guide to Air Pollution,
a take-off of George Bernard Shaw's An Intelligent
Women's Guide to Socialism but McGill Press said the
title would be confused with women's lib.
His non-medical activities could be a career in
themselves. Yet as an academic physician he has published 110 scientific papers and, recently, a 600-page
textbook on respiratory function in disease. He is
. director of the Canadian Thoracic Society, chairman of
McGill's interdisciplinary committee on air pollution, a
member of the editorial board of both Human Pathology
and Respiratory Physiology, chairman of the Canadian
Medical Association's sub-committee on environment
pollution and health, vice-president of the McGill Association of University teachers, and member of the
executive committee of McGill's Environmental Council.
He has been a visiting professor to about 10 medical
schools and hospitals in North America, was the McGill
medical school's representative to McGill's Senate, chairman of the committee for the continuing review of
McGill's government, and associate dean for graduate
studies and research in McGill's Faculty of Medicine.
Dr. Bates is a critical man. He's suspicious of
conventional wisdoms and says one of the highest duties
of   a   medical   school   is  to   instil   self-criticism   in   its
c+i i^ldntc
J1UUI.I  I i J.
'There are two cliches, things that are popularly said
all over the place. Cliche number one is that a lot of
medical work in the future will be done by para-medical
people, people in other branches of the health industry
not as expensively or thoroughly trained as doctors.
"True, I think, but reiterated ad nauseam.
"Often mentioned by the same people in the same
speech or article is cliche number two, that doctors in
the future are going to deal much more with preventive
illness, with maintaining health rather than treating
"Taken at face value there is probably truth in that
too, but it needs a great deal of qualification.
"When you place the two side by side, I'm led to
believe that the major role of para-medical people in
future will be preventive medicine — inspecting school
children, providing vaccinations — tasks the doctor is
over-educated to do.
"You're therefore faced with the fact that the doctor
must be educated to handle the most difficult tasks in
medicine. A medical student shouldn't be educated as if
he were to be a para-medical person but be taken in
depth to the most difficult areas of the profession. This
rl*.*.,.*.'*      rtrt^-.n       4-Un4.     n.,nV.,     ~.~A'.n*l     »*..^1~«*     ...III     L.Mnn».n     *.
uue»i  i   i.icaii    li la l evey   uicuii.01  MUUdlll  will  ut?L,virie  o
neurosurgeon or that kind of thing. It means that to
train a medical student as if he were to become a public
health nurse is no service at all, certainly not to the
future of health care.
"The present generation of students have a slight bias
towards involvement in primary health care, the practice
of medicine in the physician's office or in the patient's
home. It's a worthy bias. But it must be tempered with
the fact that much of an M.D.'s work will remain in the
toughest areas of medicine. It's not surprising that many
of the tough cases end up in hospital. For this reason the
large amount of time a medical student spends in a
hospital rather than in a public health centre is justified."
Dr. Bates said the physician's duty to the most
complicated problems of medicine must be reaffirmed
continuously in the face of demands that physicians
expand their primary health care role and increase their
contacts with families and the community.
Emphasis on the most profound difficulties of
disease as the essence of a medical student's education is
consistent. Dr. Bates said, with what Alfred North
Whitehead maintained was the "urriose of __ nnjwgrsitv.
The American philosopher, in his Aims of Education,
published nearly half a century ago, said the prime task
of a university was to take students to the limit of
understanding. From this flows a number of consequences about medical students and their teachers.
By being taken to the limits of understanding in a
certain area of medicine, a medical student may develop
the ability to know when he doesn't know. Dr. Bates
considers it critical that a medical student realize the
limits of his own understanding. He must develop the
habit of honestly assessing his own strengths and
weaknesses, his own shortcomings and mistakes.
"This," Dr. Bates said, "is an enormously important
gift to give him. It must be based on self-confidence. If
he doesn t come into contact with faculty members who
are careful to point out to him the mistakes they have
made and are making, or places where our ignorance is
so great that mismanagement occurs, then the student
never realizes that the best faculty members are almost
always the ones that are the most self-critical."
To take medical students to the edge of understanding, faculty members must do research, he said.
Though government support of medical research is
probably leveling off now after 10 years of steady
growth, research must remain a major activity of faculty
"You must have within a medical school a cadre of
people who can take medical students to the limit of
knowledge in their area and say, 'This is as far as we can
go. We don't know what happens beyond this point.'
"The only people who know where those fences are,
are the people working along them. I don't know the
limits of understanding in genetics. But I can peg out
some of the fences in my own area; I can tell a student
where knowledge stops in respiratory physiology and
chest diseases. You can't do that unless you are actively
or have been recently doing research in the area. There is
no such thing as an excellent teacher who stopped
original work 30 years ago, unless the courses he teaches
are elementary."
for faculty members to do research is that there is no
one else in society to do it. Dr. Bates said that some
people seem to think that pharmaceutical companies can
do basic research into the major problems of health and
disease. This isn't so. Unfortunately, no one has seen it
as his duty to emphasize that research in a crucial part
of a medical school's activity, he said.
Dr. Bates becomes UBC's dean of medicine July 1,
succeeding Dr. John F. McCreary who retired March 7 as
dean  but who  is continuing as Co-ordinator of UBC's
I icaiirr   DCieriCca   L/CIHic.     i i ic   l^giilic;   will   II ILCyi die   LUC
training of health students in medicine, dentistry,
pharmacy, rehabilitation medicine and nursing so they
can function together as a health team.
Dr. William Webber, professor of anatomy and an
associate dean of medicine, is acting dean until June 30.
6/UBC Reports/March 29. 1972
UBC Reports/March 29, 1972/7 Committee
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■■:?}:_.>i_.!!Wii^ ep Asking:Who The Hell Are We?
As distorted as the two stereotypes are, the
engineering student's is the more familiar. Many of the
epithets thrown at Gears are those that have been laid
.against any group in society that have been held below
the salt for religious, ethnic or socio-economic reasons.
Blacks, Jews, Italians, the Irish, Poles, Ukrainians and
dozens of other minority groups have had the same
bigoted profile drawn of them: unfeeling, insensitive,
and ignorant.
Up until a few years ago — statistics aren't available -
for this year — about three-quarters of all engineering
students were the first members of their families to go to
university. Compared with many an upper-mtddte-ciass
student, whose parents, relatives and family friends
probably went to university, most Gears don't have a
casual familiarity with the university when they arrive
*on campus. The environment is foreign, perhaps socially
intimidating. Could this influence the insecurity of some
Perhaps firmer ground for the ctannishness of some
Gears can be found in their curriculum and the
atmosphere of training. They spend about 30 hours a
week in classrooms and laboratories and are expected to
" ,06 hours of work at night and on weekends. They
clearly work harder than any other group on campus
with the possible exception of medical students. Their
schedule is highly structured. And because most of their
courses are unique to the Faculty of Applied Science,
they have little contact with any other group on campus.
i Fjot 40 hours a week Gears have an unaltered diet of one
another's company.
ie result is that in spite of the Gears' image of
sh^Hng contact with other groups on campus, their
-*   curriculum   makes it virtually  impossible for them to
I    'associate with the rest of the University.
Add to this an almost complete absence of female
engineering students and you have the same psychological atmosphere that pervades private boys' schools
and army boot camps. A territorial imperative develops
over "their" building and leads to rivalries similar to
Ihose between army units or fraternities. Gears are the
only group on North American campuses, with the
possible exception of athletes, that still indulge in group
narcissism. Many Gears remind us, some of us with pain,
of   the   Joe   College  atmosphere   common   in   North
j.  American universities in the past.
^ , The Gears' tremendous work load and social isolation
breeds frustration. Though engineers' "stunts" are not so
parent today, some Gears a few years ago used to
if^Re in them almost every Thursday noon. Why
Thursday? ft was the only day of the week in which
they had a long lunch hour, two hours, which gives some
idea of their schedule. Many students in other faculties
' on* campus are used to having half days and entire days
free of classes. It's also revealing that Gears participate in
sports relatively more than any other group on campus
except Physical Education students. This is probably
because of their work schedule which requires an outlet
for tension.
'.Many Gears, incidentally, say their training leaves
them culturally ignorant, unexposed to the "finer things
in life." This, of course, is true. But it's also true of a
great many other students on campus. Many artsmen go
through university without taking a liberal arts program.
Most sciencemen follow a program as far removed from
a liberal arts education as the engineer's. Yet few
avtsmen or sciencemen feel their deprivation. It's curious
that some Gears do. Is it a function of insecurity or is it
simply an objective awareness of their own limitations?
Do these engineering students reflect a state of
insecurity that exists within the profession? Probably.
According- to some professional engineers, Gears are
insecure and always have been. Before graduation,
Canadian engineering students go through a ceremony at
which they receive an iron ring. Custodians of the
ceremony have avoided publicity for generations and so
the public knows little about it. The ceremony doesn't
have its origins in antiquity. It was consciously initiated
and legally incorporated by engineers about 50 years ago
in eastern Canada in an attempt to induce pride and
self-respect among engineers. The profession had just
finished linking Canada from coast to coast by rail, a
heady engineering feat that shaped the destiny of
Canada. In spite of this, the engineers felt, they weren't
r-*,£gseiving rightful recognition in society.
The profession's public image is linked with technology and today the public holds technology suspect.
Professional engineers are doing a lot of soul-searching.
They have traditionally carried through tasks others have
given them. Now that society is objecting to some of the
results, it isn't the employer so much as the engineering
profession as a whole that receives criticism. Of all the
political, community, technical and scientific groups
involved in building, say, a dam, engineers get the dirty
end of the stick if society decides the dam was a mistake
in the first place.
Among moves to counter this situation is a review of
the engineering curricula by most engineering schools in
Canada. A major change being considered by most
schools would add more courses in the humanities and
social sciences. The Canadian Council of Professional
Engineers recently finished putting together common
guidelines for accrediting engineering schools across
Canada. The guidelines were drawn up by a standing
committee of the Council called the Canadian Accreditation Board, formed in 1965. In a statement of policy,
the Board said curricula should give engineering students
enough exposure to the social sciences and humanities to
allow them to practise efficiently when they graduate.
"In professional life," the policy statement said,
"engineers of the future will face increasingly complex
situations involving sociological and political elements in
addition to the professional, scientific, technological and
economic factors normally associated with engineering
"The development of a social consciousness requires
that specific attention be paid to the structuring of the
social sciences and humanities components. The program
should develop a student's ability to communicate his
ideas effectively both verbally and in writing. In general,
the engineering curriculum should impart to the students
a sufficient liberal education such that he could be at
ease with his future environment."
Engineering schools are now asking themselves
whether courses in pollution control, ecology,
economics, technical writing, professional conduct and
ethics should be included in the curricula. Some are
debating whether engineering should be a post-graduate
program, taken after a bachelor of arts or bachelor of
science degree. Much is being made as to whether
"applied humanities" — a term coined by A.B.
Rosenstein in A Study of a Profession and Professional
Education published in 1968 - should be added to the
The UBC engineering school's review of its
curriculum was carried out by an advisory committee to
the dean of Applied Science chaired by Dr. E.V. Bohn of
the Department of Electrical Engineering. Among the
recommendations of the committee was that three hours
a week be removed from each of the four years of the
program and replaced with three hours of applied
"Much has been written in recent years about how
runaway technology seems to be dominating, rather than
serving, human beings," the committee said in its report.
"The urgent necessity for the social control of technology to serve human needs, instead of uncontrolled
technological growth for its own sake or for the sake of
maximizing corporate profits and increasing the gross
national product irrespective of consequences, has been
gaining increasing public acceptance, at least verbally,
"Engineers, as those professionals most specifically
responsible for the design and development of modern
technology have, understandably, often been those most
resistant to the developing social awareness. Since the
University includes a targe collection of disciplines — the
humanities and social sciences — the study of which
should normally lead to an increased social awareness, it
seems most wasteful of university resources not to give
engineering students adequate exposure to these
The report has recently been distributed to faculty
members in Applied Science and has not as yet been
Much of the stereotype of the engineer is false. It
comes as a surprise to many that Gears are sentimental,
patriotic, concerned about pollution, generous, ingratiating to female faculty members and have a sense of
group honor and rough justice. For better or worse.
Gears form one of the largest groups of economic
nationalists on campus, something that will surprise
many an artsman. Theft in their building is almost
unheard of. Books and expensive equipment are
routinely left on desks overnight. Gears give more to
charity than any other student group. A few days before
the roof fell in on the engineers because of the
Neusletter, Gears gave about $8,700 to crippled
children. Gears traditionally have the best turn-out for
blood drives on campus. If the study areas of students in
the biological sciences are peppered with posters,
slogans, cartoons and press clippings about pollution,
post-graduate engineering students have schematic
diagrams and other technical information on pollution
on the walls — along with Playboy pin-ups, of course.
About 150 Gears have nearly completed an antipollution car, that runs on liquid natural gas, for entry in
a competition sponsored by the Massachusetts Institute
of Technology.
Gears, in the tradition of their profession, soon
acquire confidence in themselves unequalled on campus.
They are entrepreneurs of the first water. Engineering
students occasionally instal — not quite legally mind you
— telephones in their buildings.
Some of their pranks rival Mission Impossible. The
engineering profession and training is highly integrated.
The health sciences are only now going through the
integration that engineering education and practice has
had for decades. Engineering students learn to tackle
problems as a groups. Ideas for pranks often grow out of
group brainstorming sessions over assignment problems.
Tangents are developed, the imagination takes over.
Innovations are passed around like cigarettes, savored
and contemplated, put out and another one lit up.
Some of their best pranks have been both ingenious
and funny. A few years ago a group of Gears made their
way in the middle of the night into the offices of their
arch-rivals, the Science Undergraduate Society. Before
/morning they had built a brick wall from floor to ceiling
and from wall to wall just inside the SUS office door.
Before students came back one fall, Gears welded
together almost any old piece of metal they could lay
their hands on — reinforcing rods, galvanized steel tubs,
the differential from a car. The objets d'art were placed
at night on the plaza of the Buchanan Building, where
they remained for weeks. Then a group of Gears
descended on the plaza, denounced modern art and
smashed their creations. Some of the duped art
professors were trembling with rage.
Three years ago, about one week before the then
Please turn to Page Eleven
UBC Reports/March 29, 1972/9 INVESTIGATION
Continued from Page Eight
meeting of the Faculty Council, UBC's major disciplinary body, "...to consider what could and should be
done about the matter."
On the same day that Dean Finn issued his
statement. Alma Mater Society President Grant
Burnyeat held a news conference in conjunction with
EUS President Douglas Aldridge, who was only three
days away from succeeding Mr. Burnyeat as AMS
Mr. Burnyeat outlined what he believed was the
sequence of events which led to the publication of
the second newsletter and added: "I am now convinced that the newsletter was published in an
attempt to discredit the EUS executive."
The second newsletter, he said, was produced by a
discontented minority who felt that no apology
should have been issued by the EUS following
protests over the first newsletter since the publications were for internal readership only and that only
engineering students should be able to criticize the
newsletters' contents.
Mr. Burnyeat also told the newsmen that the
Students' Court, and not the Faculty Council, was
the appropriate body for investigating the newsletter
incident and meting out discipline.
The following day, March 14, the EUS held a
noon-hour "informational" meeting chaired by Mr.
Aldridge, which lasted one-and-a-half hours. (See
article on Pages Eight and Nine.
Speaker after speaicer at the meeting insisted that
the "racist jokes" in the two newsletters were devoid
of malicious intent and that the names of the six
students responsible for the second newsletter
shouldn't be revealed.
The meeting failed to agree on a motion
condemning the newsletters and broke up after
empowering the EUS executive to draft a public
apology for debate the following day.
On March 15 the engineers met again and without
debate approved the following motion: "We, the
members of the Engineering Undergraduate Society,
sincerely apologize for the actions of some of our
fellow members which deeply hurt many members of
our community. We hope that measures we have
taken will ensure that these actions will never occur
EUS President Aldridge told the meeting that, in
future, issues the EUS newsletter would be edited and
printed by the executive and would not be left in the
hands of various engineering clubs, as was the case in
the past. He said he would also suggest to the Faculty
Council that a committee be struck to investigate
fully the problems between the Faculty of Applied
Science and the mathematics department.
That night the Students' Council held a lengthy
debate on the incident and finally passed a five-part
motion deploring the "racism and sexism" exhibited
in the newsletters and including proposals for courses
and teach-ins "...to examine the conditions of our
society which give rise to such expressions."
On Thursday, March 16, the Faculty Council held
its first meeting, heard representations from the
mathematics and civil engineering departments, the
deans of Applied Science and Science, the AMS and
EUS and adjourned to draft its course of action. The
body met again March 23 but adjourned without
issuing a statement.
• • •
The 1972 election for Chancellor of the University
will be contested by two graduates with backgrounds
in law.
Nominated for the Chancellorship are Mr. Justice
Nathan T. Nemetz, a judge of the B.C. Court of
Appeal and Mr. Robert S. Thorpe, a Vancouver
The election for Chancellor and for 15 members of
the UBC Senate elected by Convocation will be held
June 7. Ballots in the two elections will be counted
on the afternoon of June 7 and the results announced
that night at a regular meeting of the Senate.
The Chancellor is elected triennially and serves on
both the Senate, a 101-member body that makes all
academic and curriculum decisions for UBC, and the
11-man Board of Governors, which must ratify all
Senate decisions and which also deals with UBC's
financial affairs.
UBC's Chancellor for the past three years has been
Mr. Allan McGavin, who decided not to run again for
the post before nominations were received for the
1972 election.
Convocation, the body which elects the Chancellor
10/UBG Reports/March 29, 1972
WHAT has gears in the front end and Gears in the
driver's seat? Why, UBC's unique experimental Urban
Vehicle which will be entered later this year in a
design competition sponsored by the Massachusetts
Institute of Technology. A team of students in the
Faculty  of  Applied  Science, led by  Dean McKay,
shown in the driver's seat, has designed and built the
car, which runs on liquid natural gas. Other features
include an energy-absorbing front end, a safety roll
bar and seat belts which prevent the car from
operating until they're fastened. Photo by Michael
and 15 Senate members, is made up of the
Chancellor, the President, all members of Senate, all
persons who hold academic appointments at UBC
whose names have been added to the Convocation
roll on the instructions of the President, all graduates
of UBC and those on the Convocation roll as a result
of regulation by Senate.
Mr. Justice Nemetz graduated from UBC in 1934
with a bachelor of arts degree and from the
Vancouver School of Law in 1937. He practiced law
for many years in Vancouver and was named a judge
of the B.C. Court of Appeal in 1968.
Mr. Justice Nemetz was a member of the UBC
Board of Governors from 1957 to 1968 and served as
Board chairman from 1965 until he resigned in 1968
to take up his duties with the Court of Appeal. He is
also a former president of the UBC Alumni
Mr. Thorpe holds two UBC degrees — bachelor of
arts ('29) and bachelor of laws ('50).
He has been active in community affairs in North
Vancouver, where he resides. He is a former chairman
of the Board of School Trustees for North Vancouver
and from 1968 to 1970 was a member of the North
Vancouver City Council.
What follows is an alphabetical listing of the 25
UBC graduates nominated for the 15 Convocation
seats on Senate (incumbent Convocation members are
designated by an asterisk):
DR. AARO E. AHO* - Geology graduate ('49)
and president of two mining exploration companies.
Active in fund-raising for UBC's new Geological
Sciences Centre.
MRS. M.F. ANGUS - Born Monica D. McArdle. A
former nurse, she graduated from St. Paul's Hospital
in I954 and obtained her bachelor of science in
nursing degree at UBC in I958. Currently a graduate
student in psychology at Simon Fraser University.
MRS. A.D. BEIRNES - Born Virginia Elaine
Galloway. Holds UBC degrees in arts ('40) and law
('49) and has served as president of both the
Vancouver Council of Women and United
Community Services.
MR. RICHARD M. BIBBS* - Vice-president of
B.C.'s largest lumber firm and currently a member of
UBC's Board of Governors. Applied Science graduate
('45) and former president of the Alma Mater Society
and Alumni Association.
MRS. ROSEMARY BROWN - After graduating
from McGill, obtained bachelor ('62) and master
('67) of social work degrees from UBC. Active in B.C.
Status of Women Action and Co-ordinating
Committee. Currently counsellor and social worker at
Simon Fraser University.
MR. ROBERT M. BUZZA - Arts ('57) and
Education ('60) graduate. School teacher who has
held executive posts, including president, on the B.C.
Teachers' Federation. Still active in Federation
and Applied Science (Mining) graduate. Currently a
consulting mining engineer. Active in professional and
community activities.
DR.  MILLS  FOSTER  CLARKE*  - Agriculture
graduate   ('35 and   '37)   and  director of  a  federal
government  research  station  at Agassiz.   Active  in_
Alumni Association activities.
lawyer and former federal cabinet minister. Was
Rhodes Scholar from B.C. in I936.
MR. IAN F. GREENWOOD* - Resident of
Kelowna and general manager of a major fruit
products firm. Agriculture graduate ('49) and former
president of the Canadian Food Processors'
MR. JOHN GUTHRIE* - General manager of a*
pulp mill in Prince George. Holds bachelor ('39) and
master of arts degrees ('40) from UBC and has been
active in professional organizations.
MRS. W.T. LANE* - Born Betsy Greer. Bachelor
of arts graduate ('49) and former research chemist for
the federal government and B.C. Research. Active in
Vancouver community and cultural activities.
graduate ('46) and Vancouver management consultant. Former president of the Commerce Alumni
Division and the Alumni Association.
MaryFrank Atkin. Currently director of credit and
correspondence courses for UBC's Centre for Continuing Education. Holds Commerce ('42) and Social
Work ('47 and '49) degrees from UBC.
MR. GORDON H. NEWHOUSE - Bachelor of arts
('58) graduate from UBC. Former president of the
Kelowna branch of the Alumni Association. Now 4
lives in Delta.
MISS ANNE G. PETRIE - Bachelor of arts ('68)
graduate who is currently a master of arts student in
English at UBC. Co-ordinator of the Women's Studies
program at UBC, a series of student-sponsored
lectures on the status of women in Canada.
MR. PAUL S. PLANT* - Bachelor of arts ('49)
graduate and former Alumni Association president.
Currently a member of UBC's Board of Governors.
Gorman. An Arts ('63) and Law ('68) graduate active
in community and women's activities. Involved in
provision of free legal aid through the Vancouver
Community Legal Assistance Society.
('48) graduate and president of a lumber firm. Active
in business and community affairs.
science ('67) graduate. Former AMS representative on
the Alumni Board of Management and until recently
a student representative on Senate.
Anne Wong. Bachelor of arts ('57) and social work
('58) graduate of UBC. Currently a project
co-ordinator on a research study on the status of
women in Greater Vancouver.
MR. GORDON M. THOM - Bachelor of
commerce ('56) graduate and former assistant
director of the UBC Alumni Association,
graduate and former president of the AMS. Active in
Alumni Association activities.
MR. DAVID R. WILLIAMS* - Arts ('48) and
Law ('49) graduate. Currently a member of the Board
of Governors. Active in community activities in
Duncan, where he practices law.
• • •
President Walter H. Gage has struck a committee
to nominate a successor to Dean Neville V. Scarfe as
head of the Faculty of Education. The new dean will
take office in 1973. Applications for the post are
invited and should be sent to the nominating
committee in care of the President's Office. STUDENTS   C°n tinued from Page Five
parents would feel guilty  because they weren't doing
their job. There are definite roles. We are really role
GREEN: Did you personally feel a need for outside
help when you were young?
BOB:  A  lot of help came from peer relationships,
'     < from the family. That's your main support outside the
I know one family in Vancouver I could move in on
I.        tomorrow. There would be no questions asked. I could
simply move in. It would be taken for granted that there
was   a   valid   reason   for   my   being   there.   I   would
:  t     immediately become one of the family.
' This has been a point of reference for my friends who
haven't at times been able to cope. Or to sustain
It is like a refuge. One family that you know is totally
open and generates some kind of supportive energy to
help clarify whatyou're going through. But that family is
■»  only one.
KATHY: It's a rare situation.
GREEN: Does the fact that it is rare offer a comment
on our isolated culture, in which people are separated
too much from each other, locked inside the nuclear
family situation?
KATHY:   You're married for life into that nuclear
. family. At least it's presumed to be for life. That's the
accepted romantic aim.
I GREEN:   Do   you   think   families  would   be  more
healthy and stable if they had a period of experimentation first, so people could find out what they really
needed   personally   instead   of   trying   to   imitate   the
'**■ , fomantic models suggested by the culture?
KATHY: Experimenting with other forms wouldn't
help if you were going back into a highly-structured
thing. I don't see the necessity.
GREEN: Then these new forms would become the
.^kATHY:   It's happening now. Amongst most of my
, friends the communal life-style is happening.
BOB: I only know of a few people not living together
communally. Most of my friends who have been married
are divorced or getting divorced. The relationships with
the least tension are the people who are simply living
Because they haven't gotten themselves locked into
* this artifical thing of being changed from man and
woman to husband and wife. To the extent that we
work on symbols, that's a very symbolic change. A
totally artificial change. What we have now in society is
serial monogamy. You're married ancl you get divorced.
k You marry again and then get divorced again. That's
serial monogamy.
^CREEN: You study law. Bob. Is there a widespread
IBRide of change about these things in relationship to
family life? Break-downs are human problems, not an
affront against God or State?
BOB: Law is retrospective. As soon as a lawmaker
• ' faels a need to change a law or make a new law, it has
already been outdated for some time. The law refuses to
hypothesize — it works backwards. It restricts itself to
the narrowest of grounds. It's always behind the social
realities. It would be an incredible revolution if it did
catch up.
GREEN: Is it behind the times in understanding
family life?
BOB: I think it should restrict itself to protecting
offspring. Two adults can thrash it out amongst themselves. I don't think it is the state's position to come in
and set down frameworks they should go into. People
should be free to draw up contracts or even non-
-vTnarriage contracts.
The law protects specific interests — the capitalists.
The nuclear family has been a great consumptive unit.
After World War II everything changed; the tool-up for
war produced incredible productivity. The nuclear
family was a great unit to eat up the new products.
GREEN: Because each unit repeats possession of
BOB: The communal existence is people recognizing
the fact that this kind of consumption is not essential.
Society based on consumerism is based on a false value.
GREEN: There are economies of scale in the
*   sommune?
BOB: What's lacking in society that communes are
trying to replace is that sense of trust between people.
For instance, five families live in one block: why don't
they buy one large freezer? Instead, each family buys
one and has wasted space.
My sister lives on a block with seven houses. Each
house has a lawnmower. They sit and rust and depreciate
in value.
It is a subconscious, not well-articulated aim of
communes to  react against that style of living.
KATHY: Besides being cheaper you care a lot less
about material goods. Once you're sharing things, it's
not, "I've got this. I think it's important. I've worked for
it. I own it. It's a status symbol to me."
You just share things. They're important, but they
mean less as a status symbol.
GREEN: Will you always live in a communal setting?
KATHY: The economic thing in communes is interesting. You get used to the idea that you can live on
$100 per month. It's a real shock to realize you can do
this for the rest of your life and you don't have to
change when you stop being a student.
BOB: We live in a society of experts and expertise. It
frees the ordinary person from questioning what's going
on around him. That includes questioning the quality of
family life.
There are no isolated phenomena. It's that way with
communes. They're connected to everything around
GREEN: You use terms like "community," "trust,"
"sharing," "fellowship." Do you feel that what is
happening in the communal movement is not unlike the
original impulse that created the Christian church? This
is the way religious people do talk: "good fellowship"
and "spirit of community."
KATHY: I understand what you're saying, but there
was always a force from above. In the communal
movement the focus is on the individual people.
Continued from Page Five
people, as well, simply say, "It doesn't make sense the
way we're doing it." The large proportion of people
involving themselves in communes are re-evaluating.
They say to themselves, "I need things the normal
system won't allow. There's got to be a better way."
GREEN: Do you think that part of the inspiration or
motive behind the movement is a negative one: that is, it
comes about because we tend in our society not to be
very honest about admitting our emotional needs, the
depth and variety?
HAGERTY: The idea of an isolated nuclear family
helps explain that. Most psychotherapists today agree we
are isolated from each other and even, in a sense, from
How often do we sit down with our own wife and say
honestly what we feel? Without yelling and screaming.
Say, "I don't like the way you do this." Or, "I do like
. . . . " It's harder to say you like something about your
GREEN: How extensive is the communal movement
in B.C.?
HAGERTY: There is no accurate way to determine
this. I am constantly amazed at the number of
communal groups in existence.
GREEN: Would an estimate of 10,000 people be
HAGERTY: I think that would be very conservative.
In the Slocan Valley alone there are over 400 people.
GREEN: The title of your forthcoming book is The
Elephant That Never Came: The Hippie Search for
Meaning. Is that essentially what it is all about, a search
for positive meaning for the family?
HAGERTY: You have to listen to what the young
people are saying. They say life has become meaningless.
It doesn't make sense to go to work every day to buy a
new car each year. Life like that is not rational. . . it's
irrational. We get involved in petty, meaningless things.
Life, the whole of life, becomes sterile and hollow. Their
search now is a search for some kind of meaning, if not
for God. They want to know: "What's it all about? Am I
really here just to punch a time-clock, to eat, to earn a
living? There's got to be more to it than that."
■ ■■A Jfc Vol. 18, No. 7 - March 29,
IIHl 1972- Published by the
ll^jll University of British Columbia
^^ ^^ ^^ and distributed free. UBC
REPORTS Reports appears on
Wednesdays during the University's winter
session. J.A. Banham, Editor. Louise Hoskin,
Production Supervisor. Letters to the Editor
should be sent to Information Services, Main
Mall North Administration Building, UBC,
Vancouver 8, B.C.
Continued from Page Nine
president of Simon Fraser University, Dr. Patrick
McTaggart-Cowan, was to be guest of honor at the
Engineers' Ball, they stole the mace of SFU. Three locks
were stolen from SFU and a student made a master key
from them. They had estimated they had no more than
120 seconds to steal the mace — the length of time the
area would not be seen by passing guards. The door to
the main library was unlocked and the mace taken out
of its locked case in 25 seconds. It was returned to Dr.
McTaggart-Cowan at the ball.
Three years ago they stole the 1,700-pound nine
o'clock cannon from Stanley Park. About 20 Gears with
walkie-talkies took up strategic positions at about 2 a.m.
One was stationed on the pedestrian overpass at the
entrance to the park where he had a complete view of
any car entering the park. The first news story to report
the theft mentioned that "packing paper was found at
the scene, indicating the thieves used care in the
removal." The gun was returned after $1,000 had been
pledged to One of the engineers' favorite charities, the
Children's Hospital.
These are pranks few can condemn. They are part of
a tradition that is disappearing on campuses across North
America. In continuing the tradition. Gears have
revealed themselves to be out of step with other
members of their generation. Rah-rah college days are
Few seem to realize that even at the height of pranks
by engineering students on campus, much of the Gears'
motivation was "self-fulfilled prophecy." Gears
exaggerate their actions so that they measure up to their
barbarian image in the eyes of others. It strengthens and
reaffirms the bonds that link them.
Gears secretly enjoy their reputation for crudity.
They purposely misspell words in their publications.
Many of the graffitti in the Civil Engineering Building
are about engineers. Nothing delights them more than a
Ubyssey story beginning "The engineers have done it
This still leaves us with the question of the racial
"jokes." At their meeting March 14, the Gears were
dismayed that the outside world didn't realize that the
intent was not racist. "If we apologize," one student
said, "we're saying we're racists. If we don't apologize,
they'll think we're racists." Over the years the attitude
of engineering students towards racism has been
facetious. The minutes of the EUS over the years are
sprinkled with racially-pointed resolutions such as one
requiring Chinese EUS executive members to limit
themselves to having one child in view of the population
explosion. When a Chinese student ran for an EUS
position some time ago, his opponent ran on the
platform: "I am white, not curious." It wouldn't be
surprising if one of the Gears who published the
offending Neusletter turned out to be Jewish.
One of the most mature speakers at the March 14
meeting described himself as both an engineering student
and a Jew. He intervened with the Jewish community on
behalf of the students who published the second
Neusletter. He pressed for an apology by the EUS to
appease those reacting to the Neusletter. Blame for
producing the offensive Neusletter should be shared by
all Gears, he said. "I deeply believe we shouldn't reveal
the identity of the six ... There's nothing wrong with
admitting a mistake. Okay, it happened, we're sorry,
we're human, we all make mistakes."
All of this may help us understand engineering
students a bit better. What it can't explain is the
appalling tastelessness and insensitivity of some of their
actions. Some of the antics of some engineering students
are so anti-human that it is no wonder non-engineers
tend to look upon Gears as a mindless Panzer division.
It is embarrassing even to describe some of their
behavior. Some Gears go in for a ritual called "tanking."
They grab someone and tnrow him into a pool. A
favorite over the years has been to kidnap editors and
writers of The Ubyssey. The first Ubyssey editor to be
kidnapped was Jim Banham, now editor of this newspaper. The last Ubyssey staffer to be kidnapped was
taken from his home and tied to a cross on campus.
Some Gears each year hire a woman to ride naked on a
horse in public and trot gleefully at her side.
Finally, there is the content of their Neusletter.
Whether intentionally or not, the material is often crude
and vulgar and always juvenile. An EUS defence of the
students who wrote the second Neusletter was that that
kind of material had been published in the Neusletter for
years. For many it sounded as though they were saying:
"I've been mugging people for eight years. Your Honor,
why should I be prosecuted now?"
UBd RleiborWMarcrf 29, 1972/11 ^^ UBC ALUMNI    ■ ■
New federal Minister of Urban Affairs Ron Basford
reviews his three years as consumer ancl corporate
affairs minister at a luncheon attended by 170 Home
Economics alumni. Vlad photo.
Basford Ftegrets Hostility
Mr. Ron Basford, Canada's Minister of Urban
Affairs, admitted recently that people "in certain
quarters" gave a sigh of relief when he transferred to
his new portfolio from the federal Department of
Consumer and Corporate Affairs.
He made the remark in addressing a meeting of
Home Economics alumni at the UBC Faculty Club on
Spring  Meetings
For  Branches
It looks like a very active spring for alumni branch
organizations around the country. A series of functions have been set for centres in B.C., Alberta and
Alumni in Calgary will hold a Reunion Days '72
on Friday, April 21, in the Palliser Hotel with special
guests Herb Capozzi, Social Credit MLA for
Vancouver Centre, and George Morfitt, second vice-
president, Alumni Association. The function begins
with a "happy hour" at 7 p.m., followed by a dinner
dance from 8 p.m. - 1 a.m. Tickets, $5.75 each, may
be obtained by contacting Frank Garnett, 444 — 7th
Avenue, S.W., Calgary 2, Alberta (262-7906).
A "Beer and Beef Night" is planned for Saturday,
May 27, in Ottawa. Noted UBC geneticist Dr. David
Suzuki will be featured guest and the event will be
enlivened by a rock band. The location of the event
and other details have yet to be decided. The contact
for information is Mike Hunter, Department of
Finance, Ottawa (992-4251).
Dr. George Szasz, UBC associate professor of
Health Care and chairman of the Health Sciences
Interprofessional Education Committee, will be guest
speaker at alumni branch functions planned for May
30 in Port Alberni and May 31 in Nanaimo. A noted
proponent of sex education. Dr. Szasz will speak on a
"topic of personal interest" and accompany it with a
slide show. Further details will be available later.
For further information, alumni in Port Alberni
should contact: George Plant, 503 — 17th Avenue
North, Port Alberni (723-2161), and in Nanaimo,
Alan Filmer, RR No. 1, Lantzville    (753-1141).
12/UBC Reports/March 29, 1972
March 18. A total of 170 alumni and students
attended the meeting which was sponsored by the
Home Economics Alumni Division.
Mr. Basford's comment tended to substantiate the
commonly-heard complaint that he had been transferred to a new ministry because of business opposition to his proposed new Competition Act. But he
also told the meeting he was impressed by the letters
of support he had received — over 5,200 — from
ordinary citizens on his leaving consumer and
corporate affairs.
In the three-and-a-half years he held the consumer
and corporate affairs portfolio, Mr. Basford said he
had been concerned that the "new ministry not be
window-dressing" and as a result he had stirred up
some opposition.
"In leaving the job, my principal disappointment
and regret is the hostility — the almost viciousness —
that some seem to feel towards the consumer point of
view," he said, "it has always been an article of faith
to me, and I think to most consumer activists, that to
the extent that you eliminate deception, dishonesty
and manipulation from the market place, you
strengthen the market place and free enterprise
system — not weaken it. And yet the opposition to
that kind of concept by some people has always
startled me."
He referred to the opposition to the Competition
Bill and the fact that while he had indicated in the
fall that amendments would be made in the proposed
legislation he was still being attacked months later.
"There seemed to be an unwillingness to debate
the validity of competition policy, but not an
unwillingness to accuse a minister and the government of all sorts of quite unwarranted and unfair
motives. The fact is a bald one, supported by the
Economic Council of Canada and others, that effective competition policy is an absolute essential to a
modern economy and industrial system.
"In any event, there will be new legislation and
consumers will benefit as will the economy as a
whole. And an economy that is efficient and works
well for everyone is the best thing the consumer can
have — whether he buys coal by the bucket or lumber
by the carload or butter at the corner store."
Big Block Club
Enjoys Growth
"Chick" Turner, the 1948 Canadian 100-yard
spring champion, made a comeback at UBC recently
— well, it was a comeback of a sort. "Chick,"
otherwise known as The Hon. John Turner, Canada's
Minister of Finance, returned to his alma mater to be
guest speaker at the annuas Big Block Club dinner. It
turned out to be a very amusing after-dinner speech
to a congenial gathering of more than 300 former Big
Block winners and 1971 Block winners.
John Turner, BA'49, BCL, MA (Oxford), is himself holder of a Big Block in track, having been
Canadian champion in the 100-yard and 220-yard
sprints in 1948. He won his "blue" in track at
Oxford, while studying there on a Rhodes Scholarship.
The large turnout of Big Blockers was indicative of
the new activity in the Big Block Club. The UBC
Alumni Association has been active in helping
representatives of the Club get back in touch with
many of the Big Block winners of former years.
Through this effort, a list of 1,200 Big Block winners
has been compiled. It's believed that there are^
another 1,800 for whom addresses are not available.
Big Block winners of former years are urged to
contact the UBC Alumni Association, 6251 N.W.
Marine Drive, Vancouver 8, B.C. (228-3313).
h There
A Way Out?
Lord Terence O'Neill
Former Prime Minister of Northern
Ireland, presents his view of what's
happening in Ireland today.
Thursday, May 18
Hotel Vancouver
6 p.m.
Early reservations advised
Please send me ... tickets at $6.50 each.
Enclosed is a cheque for $  	
{payable to the UBC Alumni Association)
Phone number . ......,...,	
Mail to: UBC Alumni Association, 6251
N.W. Marine Drive, Vancouver 8, B.C.


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